How to have most powerful Italy you can have in EU4 (2024)

I am trying playing as italy lately with new great project at Rome it makes catholic italy very good. So I decided to have strongest Italian nation I can have with most permenant bonuses

what do I mean:
I am not just talking about missions that give x forever. I am also considering extra goverment reform progress and other stuff that makes you amazingly broken late game (Last time I played as venice. At age of absolutism I became a monarchy and with my extra reform points I reached to 2200 governing capacity without admin ideas)
so that made me thought:What would be most powerful italy in game? Military dictatorship Italy that formed by Milan? Venice forming italy and becoming a monarchy with stupidly high amount of reforms+ ridiculus trade income? florance that just playing around papal state?
note:I don't think its most powerful option but I am not interested in papal state since its mechanics is someting I actually dislike.

If you're up for ahistorical culture switching, there are several Italian nations that have neat permanent modifiers in their mission tree (eg. Tuscany, Two Sicilies and especially Sardinia-Piemonte). (NB: S-P can only be formed by a monarchy.)

Otherwise, military dictatorship Milan is probably the strongest. All the advantages of a republic, with almost-guaranteed high-stat rulers - what's not to like?!

jonjowett said:

If you're up for ahistorical culture switching, there are several Italian nations that have neat permanent modifiers in their mission tree (eg. Tuscany, Two Sicilies and especially Sardinia-Piemonte). (NB: S-P can only be formed by a monarchy.)

Otherwise, military dictatorship Milan is probably the strongest. All the advantages of a republic, with almost-guaranteed high-stat rulers - what's not to like?!

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Yep I think that probably gives two ways to go about it.

Start as Milan and get the military dictatorship then go Tuscany > Two Sicilies > Italy and grab all the permanent modifiers along the way. Tuscany most notably gets a permanent diplomat and Two Sicilies gets tolerance of the true faith.

Start as Savoy for the 5% admin efficiency in the mission tree, then follow the same formations above. Since this route also keeps you a monarchy it also opens up a few other nearby options like forming Croatia along the way for the permanent dev cost and separatism reduction.

OP could really go crazy and start as Dithmarschen for another 5% admin efficiency then form Sardinia-Piedmont who gets the Savoy missions. They would have to flip into a monarchy though.

Kanem Bornu said:

Yep I think that probably gives two ways to go about it.

Start as Milan and get the military dictatorship then go Tuscany > Two Sicilies > Italy and grab all the permanent modifiers along the way. Tuscany most notably gets a permanent diplomat and Two Sicilies gets tolerance of the true faith.

Start as Savoy for the 5% admin efficiency in the mission tree, then follow the same formations above. Since this route also keeps you a monarchy it also opens up a few other nearby options like forming Croatia along the way for the permanent dev cost and separatism reduction.

OP could really go crazy and start as Dithmarschen for another 5% admin efficiency then form Sardinia-Piedmont who gets the Savoy missions. They would have to flip into a monarchy though.

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You forgot forming dalmatia early game as venice to get a centre of trade in Croatia

Kanem Bornu said:

Tuscany most notably gets a permanent diplomat

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You can't get Tuscan missions if you form them with anyone except Florence though, because the decision to form Tuscany lacks the 'Obtain new missions' line and effect. So it's a waste of diplo points and culture shifting, if you are planning to do it.

bokorthedust said:

You can't get Tuscan missions if you form them with anyone except Florence though, because the decision to form Tuscany lacks the 'Obtain new missions' line and effect. So it's a waste of diplo points and culture shifting, if you are planning to do it.

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Aw bummer. Thanks for pointing that one out.

nobodyinparticular said:

Like posted above, you can culture-shift your way into picking up various permanent modifiers, but if you wanna keep it simple just go Savoy -> Sardinia-Piedmont. Their perma-modifiers beat those of any other Italian tag, and you can also pick up Italy's perma-modifiers, and the Italy region also has a bunch of good great projects.

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Too bad cannot start as Provence or another tag and form Savoy via culture shift.

Florence->Tuscany->Dalmatia->S-P->Italy would be very strong and wouldn't require playing forever as Dithmarschen, but you have to be careful with your province count to be able to form Dalmatia and obviously become a monarchy to be able to form S-P.

But Savoy->S-P->Italy or Milan->S-P->Italy is good enough. Italy is my favorite place to play in EU4 thanks to the combination of high dev provinces, institution access, and the fact every major tag there has mission trees and flavor.

Terixis said:

Florence->Tuscany->Dalmatia->S-P->Italy would be very strong and wouldn't require playing forever as Dithmarschen, but you have to be careful with your province count to be able to form Dalmatia and obviously become a monarchy to be able to form S-P.

But Savoy->S-P->Italy or Milan->S-P->Italy is good enough. Italy is my favorite place to play in EU4 thanks to the combination of high dev provinces, institution access, and the fact every major tag there has mission trees and flavor.

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I love using Dithmarschen as a starting nation and then tag switching to whatever. You are right. It takes a long time to get the permanent modifiers as Dithmarschen. It’s a lot of high AE imperial conquests, but those modifiers are so sweet.

I am suprised that no one mentioned me the venice since venice got a unique very strong goverment form and if becomes monarchy will get high crown lands and also gets incrased goverment reform gain thanks to great project. Also if you form Italy before becoming monarchy you can have "strengthen counil of ten" modifier wich gives autonomy reduction without any penalty for rest of game too
but all of these are interesting. I will try Milan for sure I thought military dictatorship was not better than Ambrosian Republic as it has random rulers but will take a look

anyway since everyone shared here is my strategy as Italy
Start as venice, ally some great powers(easy for venice a lot). Spain and france are ideal.
Defeat Ottomans and take balkans. Don't annex it give it to vassals. Vassals will get goods production bonus relative to your trade power giving you more income overall while providing force limit.(bulgaria and byzantium. You can force convert them or not your decision)
after that you remain republic until age of absolutism, conquer italy and balkans while building your favors with great powers around you.
Then you form Italy and become monarchy. Doing this will make you lose some reforms but you gained so much so fast even after that you can incrase governing capacity like 12 times after age of absolutism! With estate priviladges and admin ideas if you did everything right you can have around 3000 governing capacity. Thats high enough to fully state almost entire europe! Using your favors you form unions with great powers you helped and then become great power.
Will try milan next